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View Full Version : Pure doomer porn Recovery is now impossible


Manchy
10-21-2009, 07:26 PM
An excellent article which explains why we will not have a recovery. We have crossed the Rubicon and its all downhill from here on out. Several interesting charts in the article.

http://seekingalpha.com/article/167538-greater-depression-for-u-s-rebuts-recovery-talk?source=feed

A snippet of some of the more scary stuff in the article.


First of all, in the “big picture”, the U.S.'s $11-trillion economy (all that remains once statistical “padding” is removed) is much too small to service the more than $57 trillion in existing public and private debt. Even if we pretend the U.S. still has a $14 trillion economy (despite the government's own numbers that this economy has shrunk by more than 10%), it is still much too small to service its debts. Meanwhile, lurking in the near future are roughly $70 trillion in additional “unfunded liabilities”.

As I have pointed out on a number of occasions, the U.S. can never afford to raise interest rates again (at least not until after the inevitable national default on its massive debts). Every 1% rise in U.S. interest rates drains over $500 billion per year from the U.S. economy, equivalent to roughly a 5% drop in GDP for every 1% rise in interest rates. It is also inevitable that the bond market will impose much higher interest rates on the U.S. economy – as deficits get more out-of-control (and myopic U.S. creditors finally see the total insolvency of the U.S. economy). Thus, the U.S. is guaranteed to go bankrupt – the only issue is when.

Manchy
10-22-2009, 08:39 PM
I got something similar to the letter in the article about a year ago on a card I had not used for a while. After telling them to stick their card up their ass, I felt better.

With consumer credit contracting and those will balances getting hit with 30% interest rates, regardless of the FICO scores, Christmas will look rather dismal for most.

http://market-ticker.denninger.net/archives/2009/10.html

Recovery? How, Given THIS?

This is the sort of thing that, in my opinion, makes meaningful economic recovery impossible.

http://market-ticker.denninger.net/uploads/Oct2009/citibank.png

Here's what it says:

To continue to provide our customers with access to credit, we have had to adjust our pricing.

....

These changes include an increase in the variable APR for purchases to 29.99% and will take effect November 30, 2009.

(It then goes on to say that if you pay on time you can get 10% of your interest charges back, which lowers the effective rate by about 3%.)

I have multiple copies of this letter, all on the same theme - 30% interest rates, vastly higher than they were.

The obvious message in this letter is simple: Those who are responsible and can pay their bills will be subsidizing those who cannot - that is, you, the responsible cardholder, will pay the deadbeat's bill!

Citibank has 92 million cards in circulation and is #4 in market share in terms of purchase volume, with 11.05% of the total.

Overall, consumers hold an average of 5.4 revolving (credit) cards. Half of all undergraduates in college have 4 or more cards.

Average card debt per household, including households that have no cards at all, is $8,329. For households with one or more cards, it is $10,679, both figures at the end of 2008.

Of the 73% of families with credit cards, 60.3% carried a balance. This means that for those with balances, the average balance is nearly $18,000.

If the previous interest rate on those cards was around 20% and is now 29%, the average family with a balance (about 44% of all households) was paying $3,600 in interest charges previously, but now will be paying $5,220, and increase of $1,620 a year or $135.00 a month.

There are approximately 116 million households in the US. As a consequence the decrease in disposable personal income attributable to this sort of interest rate change is approximately $113 billion, or a bit under 1% of GDP.

And that's only the direct cost of the interest. What cannot be measured is the impact on consumer spending that comes from changes in consumer behavior - that is, this is only the interest component of the change in rate.

If this interest rate change prompts people to pay down just 25% of their credit card debt over two year's time the impact on GDP simply from paying down the debt as opposed to holding it level will raise the impact to approximately 1.9% of GDP, or about $270 billion annually in foregone consumer spending.

Good luck with your "recovery" thesis folks.